Don Lemon and CNN panelist spar over Trump’s knowledge of guilt for false election claims

On Don Lemon Tonight Thursday, Lemon clashed with former CIA official, and frequent CNN analyst, Phil Mudd, over whether or not former President Donald Trump truly believed in his claims the 2020 election was stolen, or if he knowingly took part in a conspiracy to overthrow the government. While Lemon believes that the multiple former Trump staffers who have testified to the January 6th Committee that they told him he lost the election is sufficient evidence, Mudd sees things differently.

“Every single person who testified,” Lemon said, “his advisors told him — and I’m not saying you’re wrong, I’m saying on this one, every advisor — on this one you’re wrong — every single advisor told him that he lost.” “No, you’re wrong,” Mudd retorted. “No, Don, you’re wrong!”

Mudd argued that in a trial, the prosecution wouldn’t be able to prove that Trump knew he lost the election.

“You said that the president’s advisors told him that he won,” Lemon said. “Not one of the president’s advisors told him he won.” “I don’t buy it,” Mudd replied. “I’m telling you, defense attorneys are gonna find people who say the president thought he won.”

Even without the testimony from the former Trump staffers, Lemon argued that the dozens of lawsuits the former president’s legal team lost while attempting to prove voter fraud should suffice as evidence Trump was aware of the election loss.

“When he had 60 different court cases, there is no way in hell that he thought that he won, and no one with any sense told him that he won,” Lemon said. “You’re not making sense, I’m sorry. You’re not making sense right now, Phil.”

Video transcript

DON LEMON: You're not hearing what I'm saying.

PHIL MUDD: I'm hearing you.

DON LEMON: Every single person who testified, his advisors told him-- and I'm not saying you're wrong. I'm saying on this one, every advisor-- on this one, you're wrong. Every single advisor told him that he lost.

PHIL MUDD: No, you're wrong!

DON LEMON: The only people who told--

PHIL MUDD: No, Don!

DON LEMON: The only people who told him that he won--

PHIL MUDD: You're wrong!

KYLIE MAR: On "Don Lemon Tonight" Thursday, Lemon clashed with former CIA official and CNN analyst Phil Mudd over whether or not former President Donald Trump actually believed what he was saying about the election being stolen or whether he knowingly took part in a conspiracy.

Multiple advisors to the former President have testified to the January 6 committee that they told Trump he had legitimately lost the election. Mudd argued that Trump's knowledge of guilt would never hold up in court.

DON LEMON: You said that the president's advisors told him that he won. Not one--

PHIL MUDD: Correct.

DON LEMON: --of the president's advisors told him he won.

PHIL MUDD: I don't buy it. I'm going to tell you, defense attorneys are going to find people--

DON LEMON: OK.

PHIL MUDD: --who say the president thought he won.

DON LEMON: Fine, OK.

PHIL MUDD: Let's go, Don. Come on.

KYLIE MAR: Lemon argued that the dozens of court cases Trump's legal team lost while attempting to prove voter fraud should be sufficient evidence that the former president knew he lost the election.

DON LEMON: When he had 60 different court cases, there is no way in hell that he thought that he won, and no one with any sense told him that he won. You're not making sense. I'm sorry. You're not making sense right now, Phil.

PHIL MUDD: All right. You lose.

DON LEMON: OK.

PHIL MUDD: But go ahead.

KYLIE MAR: But Mudd believes that Trump's advisors who testified to the committee that he lost the election told him something different at the time.

PHIL MUDD: Come on!

DON LEMON: I'm asking you to tell me--

PHIL MUDD: You're going--

DON LEMON: --one person who's-- one advisor, legitimate advisor, who testified to the committee, and they told them--

PHIL MUDD: Well, because--

DON LEMON: --that Donald Trump won.

PHIL MUDD: Because they told the committee something different than they told the president!

DON LEMON: Oh, Phil. You are--

PHIL MUDD: Oh, come on!

DON LEMON: Come on, man. You're fishing.

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